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Separate start capacitor for BM?
Sherman
I'm in the middle of tearing down a BM (Westinghouse WW TR441), in preparation for rewiring with a toggle on/off switch, and have come to the realization that the start capacitor is wired to the logic board. From what I can tell, the motor is an AC motor, and the capacitor is 250V.

How do I proceed here? Do I need to find another 250v capacitor, or do I attempt to "de-couple" the existing one and rewire it in?

thanks,
-s.
 
seedlings
OK, first, Sherman, DON'T PANIC!

Whew. That was a close one.

The first (and second) breadmaker I rewired also had the cap on the circuit board.

Can you take a picture of the board and post it or email it to me at [email protected]? Top and bottom of the board if you can.

You will have to solder a wire. I have another post about this and I'm looking for it right now... hang on...

OK, here it is:
http://coffeesnob...0969753/15

i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb54/seedlings/ImageBMRewire.jpg

*WARNING, DON'T TRY THIS UNLESS YOU HAVE GREAT INSURANCE*
So, *IF* your machine is like mine, you should *GENERALLY* be able to:

1) Cut the appliance cord near the circuit board
2) Attach a power switch to the hot side of the cord
3) Cut the Red motor lead and splice both ends of Red to the new power switch
4) Cut the Black motor lead and splice both ends of Black to the neutral from the cord.

CHAD
Edited by seedlings on 03/31/2009 2:51 PM
Roaster: CoffeeAir II 2# DIY air roaster
Grinder: Vintage Grindmaster 500
Brewers: Vintage Cory DCU DCL, Aeropress, Press, Osaka Titanium pourover
 
Sherman
I'm trying to decide how to proceed here - the wiring diagrams in the threads here seem pretty easy to follow. Either way, all i have to do is:

1) Determine which terminal on the cap is hot vs. neutral - if I use the existing circuit board, I can trace the AC OUT coming from the power cord back through the circuitboard to the cap - that tells me which side of the cap is neutral.

2) Reconnect the motor back to cap

3) Complete the circuit (via solder or other means).

So, if I label the connection points:

P+ - Power cord / AC in (+)
M1+ - Motor (+)
M2+ - Motor (+)
M1- - Motor (-)
C+ - Cap (+)
C- - Cap (-)
P- - Power cord / AC out (-)

P+ connects to M1+
M2+ connects to C+
M2- connects to C-
C- connects to P-

M2- to C- / C- to P- may be terminated at the same point.

Now, my assumption is that either I can solder the appropriate connections, or I can attempt to source another 10uF 250V start capacitor. Is that about right?

CHAD - thanks for the info and diagrams.

-s.
 
bvwelch
Sherman,

Is there anything worth saving on the circuit board? I usually discard them.

If you plan to discard, why not de-solder the capacitor from the board?

Or maybe use an exacto knife to cut the PCB traces around the capacitor -- isolate its PCB pads from the rest of the circuit board. Then solder a couple wires to the capacitor's PCB pads.

-bill
Edited by bvwelch on 04/01/2009 1:04 AM
 
seedlings

Quote

Sherman wrote:
I'm trying to decide how to proceed here - the wiring diagrams in the threads here seem pretty easy to follow. Either way, all i have to do is:

1) Determine which terminal on the cap is hot vs. neutral - if I use the existing circuit board, I can trace the AC OUT coming from the power cord back through the circuitboard to the cap - that tells me which side of the cap is neutral.

2) Reconnect the motor back to cap

3) Complete the circuit (via solder or other means).

So, if I label the connection points:

P+ - Power cord / AC in (+)
M1+ - Motor (+)
M2+ - Motor (+)
M1- - Motor (-)
C+ - Cap (+)
C- - Cap (-)
P- - Power cord / AC out (-)

P+ connects to M1+
M2+ connects to C+
M2- connects to C-
C- connects to P-

M2- to C- / C- to P- may be terminated at the same point.

Now, my assumption is that either I can solder the appropriate connections, or I can attempt to source another 10uF 250V start capacitor. Is that about right?

CHAD - thanks for the info and diagrams.

-s.


P+ to C+ AND M+
M2+ to C-
M1- to P-

i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb54/seedlings/CapandMotor.jpg

M2+ is a separate winding in the motor and only connects to the other side of the cap to P+. The cap changes the phase of the 120V, adding torque.

This is with the cap mounted to the board or desoldered as Bill suggested.

CHAD
Edited by seedlings on 04/01/2009 8:17 AM
Roaster: CoffeeAir II 2# DIY air roaster
Grinder: Vintage Grindmaster 500
Brewers: Vintage Cory DCU DCL, Aeropress, Press, Osaka Titanium pourover
 
Sherman
CHAD -

Thanks for the correction. I must confess that, after weighing the options, I decided to reconnect (almost) all of the wiring for the circuit board.

My intent behind yanking the cap was twofold - first, I noticed the heating element come on during the 'dough' cycle, and figured that if I bypassed the circuitry altogether, I could avoid the element, and second, that I wanted to mount a switch on the body of the BM for on/off.

Now, a smarter person than myself would consider the first point and say "well, why don't you just disconnect the leads to the heating element?"

After 15 minutes of careful consideration (and 2 fingers of bourbon), I came to the conclusion that I could do just that.

The down side of this method is that I will continue to deal with the dough cycle, which spins intermittently for 90 seconds, then constantly for the next 15 minutes or so (I stopped after 15 minutes, it might go further...) until I get the motivation to either solder the correct wiring in, or receive a gift from the capacitor fairy.

As an aside, I scored a thermocouple thermometer from eBay that runs on a 9v, accepts 2 mini size TC connectors, and has options to show T1, T2 or delta ( absolute(T1-T2) ) for $25 USD, and furthermore nailed a couple of type-J thermocouples from American Science and Surplus for CHEAP! ($15 USD)

A few rubber grommets and a 11/64 drill bit later, I have ET and BT capability! I'll have to post some pics soon.

Thanks for all the input,

-s.
 
seedlings
WOW! I need to start watching for one of those jobbies!

I think, even if you left the intermitten cycle in, start a preheat, then once it goes full spin, dump the beans in. My only concern now is what happens after 15:00... so you'll have to do another trial and see.

Less is more. I have another BM I just rewired, but I left the heat element connected! I'm going to be trying it as soon as Spring shows up. It snowed here in Missouri yesterday - boo.

CHAD
Roaster: CoffeeAir II 2# DIY air roaster
Grinder: Vintage Grindmaster 500
Brewers: Vintage Cory DCU DCL, Aeropress, Press, Osaka Titanium pourover
 
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