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12/02/2023 1:17 AM
morning, sloppyjosh

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Takin' It To The Street


freshbeans wrote:
A good source for Vac pots would be appreciated . As always Thanks -Scott

For unbreakable (SS) the Nicro pots are almost always available on Ebay for a reasonable price and have one of the best filters ever invented for a vacuum brewer. Brew quantity is somewhere between 1 and 1.5 liter.


The glass model seen in the video I posted is the Hario TCA-5 but only brews 20 oz. Good for show but you'd need a few going at the same time.
For heat you can use the Hario beam heater at $350.00 a pop or find a propane solution.


Unless you are as quick and ambidextrous as a Benihana table side chef you will (as you mentioned) definitely want conventional brewers as well to allow volume brewing.

1/2 lb and 1 lb drum, Siemens Sirocco fluidbed, presspot, chemex, cajun biggin brewer from the backwoods of Louisiana
I have to back-up a little.....What is the margin on quality
ice-cream? a pairing perhaps. -Scott
I'm considering dropping the espresso thing. I prefer the 'flash and mystique' of the vacpots. I only have 2 hands.
Am I shooting myself in the foot? -Scott
Espresso drinks are big margin items...don't know what you can get for a vacpot cup.
It comes down to what your goals for the business or cash. You can have both but without enough cash its going to be tougher to have fun. Unless of course this is just going to be a hobby, but I get the feeling your goals are to be both financially successful and have some good times while your at it.
oh and if you really want to get the word out We built a few of these with plans for people on foot slangin' iced coffee.
Sean Harrington
Scott, I've seen this a dozen times. A technical person who jumps into the portion of starting a new business where they know the most information. In your case, roasting and making coffee. I just assumed you had already decided on what you wanted and had run some numbers so knew it would be profitable. I think it is time for you to figure out what your basic business plan is, then your marketing plan, and THEN do your equipment design. You don't have to do anything fancy, just make sure you think this through from the beginning.
Both points taken. Further, this is not a mistake new to me. A friend (older and wiser) helped me put the roasting biz into excel. I was amazed at what came out the other end. It certainly changed my approach. This deserves due diligence as well.
I would be curious of the people that have worked the farmers markets etc. What are the high demand items? Just because the numbers work on a product, doesn't mean anyone wants it.
As always, Thanks-Scott
OK, two hands I understand, four would be better Scott!

Most local yokel guys at a shop near you have the same with half the hands cooking buns while the other is making the coffee/pouring over grounds/
making iced coffee from scratch (read espresso most likely here unless you create
an extremely special "iced coffee."

and of course that is seasonal, the rest the time you must have a "bad weather" brew!!

tuff call Scott.

You have the coffee knowledge, you have the equipment and clearly the savvy, talent and guile to do it (along with the way cool glasses) go try out ideas and see what works.

Get the cart gassed up, use some quiet portable power for a week, toss on the siphon, an espresso a machine and hit a local corner that is NOT TO BUSY for a few days. You will now what you can and want to do after that plus you have the ability to make it change overnight. Someone has a party and wants "The Espresso Truckster" on site, you be there.

Tons-o-possibilities but until you take that "little red truckster" out for a ride you will never know.

My guess is that you will toss more brewed coffee out then you would espresso so clearly having that ability is not something you should not toss away before you have even given it a chance.

Would you serve your Grandmother 30 minute old brewed coffee? No, any shop can do that and do. Not Scott...

love ya,

I think Ginny is spot-on in saying you have to give it a whirl to know what the demand for each item is going to be. The demand for drip versus espresso based drinks will vary depending on location/clientele. A college town location right next to the university is going to be big on espresso based drinks and a coin toss on drip. OTOH, with a spell binding siphon show you might end up changing the balance even in that venue.

If you decide to do espresso it's obviously a necessity to set up for speed to avoid the grumbling line.
1/2 lb and 1 lb drum, Siemens Sirocco fluidbed, presspot, chemex, cajun biggin brewer from the backwoods of Louisiana
I wouldn't rule out anything until due diligence is done. With that in mind, here's an idea for espresso based drinks.
If Jimbo can admit to a 'decent' beverage at charbucks, than I can admit to owning a Miele CVA 4070.
It's a super automatic that draws around 12 amps. It's nearly hands free, and looks cute.
There has to be a way to get a respectable shot out of this thing.

The question; Does this use more elec than I would need for a more traditional machine? Thanks,Scott
JETROASTER attached the following image:


freshbeans wrote:
I wouldn't rule out anything until due diligence is done. With that in mind, here's an idea for espresso based drinks.
If Jimbo can admit to a 'decent' beverage at charbucks, than I can admit to owning a Miele CVA 4070.
It's a super automatic that draws around 12 amps. It's nearly hands free, and looks cute.
There has to be a way to get a respectable shot out of this thing.
The question; Does this use more elec than I would need for a more traditional machine? Thanks,Scott

A Pavoni single group with a boiler draws 13.5 amps which is probably pretty standard for this type of machine. Even at 13.5 amps, these 120 v rigs will require you to wait 2-5 min between long frothings to rebuild steam.

Can your machine keep the frothing going without long pauses?

An obvious option would be a separate frother.

One factor affecting how close a superauto can come to a traditonal is how adjustable it is. Commercial superautos are able to have the tamp pressure adjusted which makes all the difference in the world. While working at a roastery a few years back, along with roasting, I also set up a few Franke (ESI) superautos. When tamp pressure, grind size and water temp was right on we got pretty close to what you could get in a traditional machine. Of course, if the customer base is average milk based drinkers, the difference may not be that discernible.
1/2 lb and 1 lb drum, Siemens Sirocco fluidbed, presspot, chemex, cajun biggin brewer from the backwoods of Louisiana

way cool look.

if you get a small generator you can stick it under the bed someplace and it would most likely be noise free.

Your theme from retro, to art deco to state of the art will work. Very sexy and complete in a way since coffee has been around for those periods.

Are you renting the camel or will you keep her in the warehouse and feed her only coffee trees and palm milk??

Gotta tell ya Scott you have the makings of an incredible cart.

The truckster is at this point simply your canvas!

I think we all need to send Scott pictures of cool things we find that may work for his Truckster!! Post them here.

Hi Allen,
Milk froth/steam; not the machines strong point. It really does froth great, but it doesn't heat the milk. It uses a steam jet to recirc the milk past an air induction fitting. Froths quick, but no meaningful heat. I can eliminate the induction fitting and go straight steam, but I just don't see it keeping up w/ a high demand for hot milk.
So I think I'll need some form of steamer/frother.

Ginny, I don't have a line on the camel yet! I appreciate
the encouragement.

I'll take any and all ideas, then narrow the list as the project moves forward.
Anything that doesn't fit in the truckster, might wind up in the ambulance.
That's J.T.R. part 2 Thanks All -Scott
Consider a lever Espresso machine. some of them have propane heaters. I have one that's a dual heat source.... 240v internal heater coil and it has a propane burner under the boiler. Needs only water and propane.... functional and retro

Edited by milowebailey on 08/02/2010 8:48 AM
It's on my wishlist! Thanks,Scott
Thanks for the information.

I had no idea they made a propane Espresso machine??
Having checked over the Miele super-auto, it seems that tamp pressure is not adjustable. Brew temp, grind, coffee
quantity, and water quantity are adjustable.
I think it's a matter of finding the sweet spot. Not being a huge espresso guy, what's the magic indicator?
Also looking for a good bean for testing this thing....In stock I have Honduran FTO old crop, Dominican FTO, Sumatran, Costa Rican Lourdes..., Yirgacheffe, Honduran new crop.
As always, Thanks, -Scott
Taste, all The magic aside. Pressure,water temp,grind and tamp pressure, all variables should be refined. Though if your marketing frothy milk drinks, pulling perfect shots isn't quite as important. If your pride can handle it. ;)

Sean Harrington
Scott, presence of crema is a good sign of a good shot. Also, and these are just guidelines, you want all three of these things to happen at the same time for a double-shot: 30 seconds from start to finish, coffee stream just beginning to turn blonde (light), and 2 ounces of espresso in the cup. If you nail all these then you'll be very close. When you do, taste the result. If it is bitter, reduce your water temperature, if acidic, then increase it.

I would not start with single origins for espresso testing unless it is a Brazil. Get yourself a preblend like SweetMarias "New Classic."
Great stuff with time/color/quantity...thanks. Why is the Brazil singled out?
I do have some scary Vietnam robusta kicking around.
High quality Brazils do well on their own for espresso and are a common base for blending. Notice Dan said 'start with' because there are a great many single origins that make nice 'spro, but you would be well served to know what you want first. I didn't know what I want, and did all my learning through reading, not tasting... I may have crap espresso, but I like it fine.

Another option is to visit a local espresso bar... if there is one worth a hoot... and sample theirs, perhaps even pick up some of their beans (if what you taste is any good) and use that for calibration of grind/dose for a 25~30s 2oz shot.

Let any recently roasted coffee rest for 4+ days before pulling as 'spro.

Edited by seedlings on 08/11/2010 3:23 PM
Roaster: CoffeeAir II 2# DIY air roaster
Grinder: Vintage Grindmaster 500
Brewers: Vintage Cory DCU DCL, Aeropress, Press, Osaka Titanium pourover
I think I'm looking for something to slice through the milk,
rather than a traditional Italian style. As Sean pointed out, this is not all about pride. Sometimes it's just about what they want.
I've never roasted a pre-blend, how does that work out?
Roasting preblends can be a challenge. The reason is that each bean in the mix is going to go through first and second crack at its own pace. I've had preblends that begin cracking and never stop. What this means is that going by cracks is not your best temperature guideline. For preblends, what I do is go by smell.

Chad's suggestion is a good one. Buy some roasted beans you know are good and then begin there. This reminds me, what I did when I taught myself how to pull shots was buy roasted/ground coffee from Illy. That way, the roast and grind factors had been dealt with and I could focus on tamping and timing the shot.
That makes good sense. I'll grab some Illy. The Miele unit has a chute to bypass the hopper and grinder. I'll drop in some Illy, create a base-line, and work off that.
I'm hoping to get some tech info from the folks at Miele.
I'm curious what the pump can handle.
I could potentially add some tamp pressure by adding some schim below 3 springs. They seem to control the down pressure. That would be nice, but only if the pump can handle it. We'll see.
As always, thanks for the insights. -Scott
Concerning pumps;
These P1 pumps are something I see frequently in my biz. I was also familiar with the cp7.

The cp7 is listed for small coffee machines. The P1 is not. The P1 actually seems like the better pump.

Is there some reason why it should NOT be used for a coffee maker ? Thanks, Scott
The CP7 is a diaphram pump, commonly called a vibe pump, and is used in most home and prosumer espresso machines, but never commercial machines. I am not familiar with the P1 style.

Most commercial machines use a carbonator, rotary vane type pump like the Procon.

I put a Shur-Flor triple-diaphram pump on my prosumer machine. I believe there are available in 12VDC, too.
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