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Homeroasters - Home Roasting Coffee Community » THE ART OF ROASTING COFFEE » Roasting Coffee

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Behmor 1600 question
Captain Spaulding	#1 Posted on 05/03/2020 10:25 AM
Newbie Posts: 5 Joined: May 03, 2020	Hi All, Sorry for this drawn out question, but...I've had my Behmor since '09. Had gotten good roasts with stock profiles (mostly P2/B), then I upgraded to the "plus" panel last year and made a bean cooler. Both work fine, and I can now monitor temp during the roast. I realize this isn't a "true" temp, but gives me some reference numbers. Well, since these "improvements" I no longer get the flavor nuances I used to! I have varied charge weight and all the variables I can think of. I know that my typical 400g bean charge is more than what most people recommend, but I've tried various weights down to 100g with no improvement, and I had gotten good results with this weight before the above changes. I'm wondering if I'm carrying too much heat past 1st crack, and/or not enough time. Pressing the "B" button, I run around 305 degrees at 1C till cool, and press cool after around 2:30 to 3:00 min after 1C. What really made me mad was that I had tried to roast some Ethiopia Dry Process Hambela Buku 13 Screen beans, but the beans were so small, that they fell through the mesh of my drum, burned, and caused an error code/stoppage in roast, so I had to throw the batch away. I then roasted them in a stove top skillet, and although I didn't do a very good job, I tasted berry flavors that I haven't for the past year! I want to get that back from my Behmor! Any suggestions would be VERY much appreciated. Thanks!


Captain Spaulding	#2 Posted on 05/09/2020 1:38 PM
Newbie Posts: 5 Joined: May 03, 2020	Uh...hello? Sound check...is this thing on?


JackH	#3 Posted on 05/09/2020 6:05 PM
Administrator Posts: 1809 Joined: May 10, 2011	Sorry that there has not been any responses so far. We do have members here that use the Behmor. Hopefully someone will be able to offer some suggestions. ---Jack KKTO Roaster.


Captain Spaulding	#4 Posted on 05/10/2020 12:23 PM
Newbie Posts: 5 Joined: May 03, 2020	Thanks Jack, I appreciate your reply! This probably won't make more responses likely, but to simplify my question, can someone tell me if they have a target "B" temperature for the interval between 1C and cool? I appreciate any input.


mtbizzle	#5 Posted on 05/10/2020 1:12 PM
1/4 Pounder Posts: 101 Joined: April 22, 2020	You could check out Tabacaru's videos on youtube. I have heard several people getting good results with his process and he does a good job of explaining things. There are also two threads at home-barista that I thought had good info on roasting approach with the Behmor -- "behmor - optimizing 1/4 pound roasts" "Behmor 1600 too slow?" And some videos I think generally have some good info: Two videos with Joe Behm: https://www.youtu...899VD-5eUA https://www.youtu...QdLx1xCF_o Sweet marias: https://www.youtu...29bBipusyg Roast: Kaldi wide, SR800 + projects Grind: Lab sweet, Bentwood, giota w/ MP burrs, Commandante Pull: Decent, La Pavoni, Elektra Microcasa a Leva, Faemina anno 60, Kim Express


Captain Spaulding	#6 Posted on 05/10/2020 1:34 PM
Newbie Posts: 5 Joined: May 03, 2020	Thanks mtbizzle, I had tried the technique on Sweet Maria's site and it really didn't improve anything for me, but I'll check out the threads you mentioned as well as the YouTube site.


renatoa	#7 Posted on 05/11/2020 2:22 AM
Administrator Posts: 3005 Joined: September 30, 2016	Quote Captain Spaulding wrote: Thanks Jack, I appreciate your reply! This probably won't make more responses likely, but to simplify my question, can someone tell me if they have a target "B" temperature for the interval between 1C and cool? I appreciate any input. Assuming you have a VERY accurate bean temperature measurement method, is more important to watch rate of rise evolution, than a target temperature. The average RoR (rate of Rise) should be in the 5 C degrees ballpark, during development interval, associated by many with FC (First Crack), but development could extend after FC finishes. For example you can have end of FC one minute from start, and continue development for two minutes more, for a total of three minutes. Yes, there could be a target temperature too, but it depends on your BT measurement precision. For example, my BT drop temperature is always before 212 C, but this depends on machine and roasting style, I am a light-medium guy. For full medium you should aim at 216 C, and from 220 C you can expect enter SC in any moment. Never ventured so far The goal of this average can be accomplished in various ways... let's assume you have planned a 2 minutes development, and RoR reads 6 C degrees per minute at FC moment. If after one minute RoR reads 5, and after one more minute RoR reads 4, then you are good, goal accomplished, you had a nice continuous decreasing RoR, and a 5C average. If your setup don't allow for RoR measurement, then you should note the temperatures at FC and every minute after FC, then compute the average on paper after the roast. If you read something like FC 200 - then 205-206, then 209-211, you are good. If goal not accomplished you should analyse you roast data, see how RoR evolved the two minutes before FC, and change power management plan for next roast accordingly. i.e. increase or decrease power, to adjust the RoR momentum (speed or velocity of RoR changes before FC) Sure, there are various development management "schools", you can embrace any of them if giving good results. For example RAO advise 20 to 25% development time, which is 2-3 minutes if FC at minute 8. At the other extreme, a typical nordic school roast could approach FC with a great RoR value, maybe even 10C/min, but a very short development, maybe even under one minute. I am inbetween these limits, using 1.5-2 minutes development, with FC at 9-10 minutes, so 15% by RAO notation. The longer the development, the more difficult is to accomplish this goal, and easier to bake beans. For example if you aim to reach 220 C during a 10 minutes development, having FC at 200 C, then the average RoR must be 2C per minute (220-200/10). This is almost a technical impossibility to measure and maintain steadily. To measure RoR under 3C/min you need measurement precision of at least 0.1 C and noise under 0.05C degrees, or averaging window of 30 seconds to one minute, which make very difficult to foresee the slope evolution. Unless you have a great thermal inertia machine, which Behmor is not.


Captain Spaulding	#8 Posted on 05/11/2020 4:49 PM
Newbie Posts: 5 Joined: May 03, 2020	Hi renatoa, Thanks so much for the very detailed reply. Your answer has confirmed the conclusion I had already reached. Namely, time for a new machine that will allow for more useful measurements. I wanted to be sure that lack of knowledge or technique wasn't the problem. I know this is a topic for a whole new thread, so I won't ask for machine recommendations here, although if you have one with a near 1lb capacity, I wouldn't complain. I realize that there are many different directions...gas, electric, etc. In any case, thanks again!


mtbizzle	#9 Posted on 05/11/2020 5:37 PM
1/4 Pounder Posts: 101 Joined: April 22, 2020	This guy has worked out a way to get a probe into the Behmor's bean cage -- one method for just getting into there that requires no modification, another that gets a probe probably really close/touching beans but requires some drilling -- https://youtu.be/...kXgc?t=811 Roast: Kaldi wide, SR800 + projects Grind: Lab sweet, Bentwood, giota w/ MP burrs, Commandante Pull: Decent, La Pavoni, Elektra Microcasa a Leva, Faemina anno 60, Kim Express


av8bdriver	#10 Posted on 12/15/2020 8:42 AM
Newbie Posts: 2 Joined: December 12, 2020	Quote mtbizzle wrote: You could check out Tabacaru's videos on youtube. I have heard several people getting good results with his process and he does a good job of explaining things. There are also two threads at home-barista that I thought had good info on roasting approach with the Behmor -- "behmor - optimizing 1/4 pound roasts" "Behmor 1600 too slow?" And some videos I think generally have some good info: Two videos with Joe Behm: https://www.youtu...899VD-5eUA https://www.youtu...QdLx1xCF_o Sweet marias: https://www.youtu...29bBipusyg Just wanted to thanks for pointing me in the right direction. Finally I found the fruit in these Ethiopians!. Using Tabacaru's method really made the difference. So thank you so much.


louca	#11 Posted on 03/15/2021 12:32 PM
Newbie Posts: 15 Joined: September 17, 2010	Hi Capt. I am a VERY new beginner at roasting and have just acquired a Behmor 2000AB+. My response here will pale intellectually with respect to others above. I feel in no way capable of answering your question with any kind of definitive answer, but I am wondering about something you said. You said the only additions to the roaster were: 1) the new control panel; and 2) a bean cooler. Assuming the control panel works exactly the same as the previous one (which is a HUGE "if"), I wonder about the bean cooler. How does it work? Does it sort of sharply cool the roast at some desired point? I am on a very steep learning curve, reading and hearing lots of different information, some of which I can make sense out of and some I have more difficulty. But I thought I learned somewhere that if the beans are cooled too fast, not necessarily too soon in the roast but too sharply, it can drastically affect the flavors of the roast. I am still learning so I could be totally wrong about things. Experts, or anyone with more than 6 roasts under their belt, please inform or correct me. Thanks. �� Aillio R1 V2 Bullet, Behmor 2000AB+, Fellow Ode grinder, Escali L-600 scale, V60-02. "I feel more like I do now than I did when I got here."

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