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Boca Boca v2 - pretty KKTO with cyclone seperator?
mtbizzle
Top  #1 Print Post
Posted on 07/07/2020 8:46 AM
Saw this on another site today -



https://www.youtu...KSmtnERi04

Boca Boca v2 - totally different design than their original.

Reminds me of KKTO with a cyclone separator, made all pretty for the cafe.
Edited by JackH on 07/07/2020 5:46 PM
Roast: Kaldi wide, SR800 + projects
Grind: Lab sweet, Bentwood, giota w/ MP burrs, Commandante
Pull: Decent, La Pavoni, Elektra Microcasa a Leva, Faemina anno 60, Kim Express
 
renatoa
Top  #2 Print Post
Posted on 07/07/2020 8:54 AM
Pretty "cheap" for a cycloned TO... at 6 grands Grin

Mine cost me 20x less to build, and is very close as overall concept.




https://www.youtu...lhlej_dgHE

Wondering how much would cost a hobbyist to tailor such shiny clothes to his home built roaster ... Grin
Edited by renatoa on 07/08/2020 3:47 AM
 
mtbizzle
Top  #3 Print Post
Posted on 07/07/2020 12:16 PM

Quote


Wondering how much would cost a hobbyist to tailor such shiny clothes to his home built roaster ... Grin


This is how you make your millions!
Roast: Kaldi wide, SR800 + projects
Grind: Lab sweet, Bentwood, giota w/ MP burrs, Commandante
Pull: Decent, La Pavoni, Elektra Microcasa a Leva, Faemina anno 60, Kim Express
 
JackH
Top  #4 Print Post
Posted on 07/07/2020 5:45 PM

Quote

renatoa wrote:

Pretty "cheap" for a cycloned TO... at 6 grands Grin

Mine cost me 20x less to build, and is very close as overall concept.

https://www.youtu...lhlej_dgHE

Wondering how much would cost a hobbyist to tailor such shiny clothes to his home built roaster ... Grin


I like your turbo setup! Do you have any trouble with the holes in the bottom of the roast chamber damaging the beans? (like a cheese grater).
---Jack

KKTO Roaster.
 
Koffee Kosmo
Top  #5 Print Post
Posted on 07/07/2020 6:11 PM
That makes 2 of my inventions are being utilised for commercial use

1) Roaster (As above ) it may not be the same but it?s the same overall concept - and I actually have drawings of a similar roaster but the Boca uses a simple heat distribution from above

I should make note that the method of heat and heat transfer on my commercial KKTO design is more sophisticated than the crude method the Boca Boca uses thumbdown

2) The Koffee Kosmo milk steamIng method
Yes there is a machine that auto mimics my milk steam method

https://youtu.be/...

KK
I home roast and I like it. Designer of the KKTO
Roaster Build information
https://homeroast...ad_id=1142

https://docs.goog...lide=id.i0
Blog - http://koffeekosm...gspot.com/

Bezzera Strega, Mazzer Robur Grinder, Pullman Tamper Convex,
(KKTO) Turbo Oven Home Roaster.
 
Web
renatoa
Top  #6 Print Post
Posted on 07/08/2020 2:06 AM

Quote

JackH wrote:

I like your turbo setup! Do you have any trouble with the holes in the bottom of the roast chamber damaging the beans? (like a cheese grater).


Didn't noticed any damage, they are 3,6 mm diameter, so half of the average bean I roast.
True, I don't roast peaberry, and I groom my beans, so no small or broken bean with sharp edges in the pot.
But the most important, the holes are made using a press, not drilled, or jet/laser cut.
So the edges are rounded inside, no sharp at all, any discontinuity unnoticeable when you walk your finger on that surface.

Isn't the bottom of your pasta insert holey as well ?
 
JackH
Top  #7 Print Post
Posted on 07/08/2020 8:14 AM

Quote

renatoa wrote:

Isn't the bottom of your pasta insert holey as well ?


It was at first but I added a bottom plate and kept the side holes. I guess my agitator was a bit too aggressive and was slicing some beans along the bottom.
---Jack

KKTO Roaster.
 
renatoa
Top  #8 Print Post
Posted on 07/08/2020 9:27 AM
Or holes too big...

I prefer my perforated bottom roast pan because the original airflow pattern is kept almost unchanged, i.e. vertical along the walls, down to the bottom, passing through the coffee beans bed, and ascending back in the middle, sucked by the turbine.
With lateral perforations, an escape path is created for the airflow to shortcut the original pattern, thus less convection, more radiation.
With a solid bottom, even worse... that path lateral is enforced as the only possible way for the air to close the circuit, so the airflow in the beans mass will be reduced to agitation only.
Attaching a picture for a better image of the airflow in a TO machine.
renatoa attached the following image:
to_diagram.jpg
 
renatoa
Top  #9 Print Post
Posted on 07/10/2020 2:18 AM
Let's put aside the envy of some of us about the Boca Boca achievement Grin, and let's try dissect it to extract the good ideas we can use to improve our hobbyists machines.

For instance, I am trying for long time to find a more streamlined method to drop the beans for cooling, instead extracting the roasting pot with thermal gloves, or similar methods with high risk of burning.

What is your understanding of the way Boca Boca is dropping the beans into a (perforated?) drawer placed on a lower floor, under the RC?
 
Koffee Kosmo
Top  #10 Print Post
Posted on 07/10/2020 3:53 AM

Quote

renatoa wrote:

Let's put aside the envy of some of us about the Boca Boca achievement Grin, and let's try dissect it to extract the good ideas we can use to improve our hobbyists machines.

For instance, I am trying for long time to find a more streamlined method to drop the beans for cooling, instead extracting the roasting pot with thermal gloves, or similar methods with high risk of burning.

What is your understanding of the way Boca Boca is dropping the beans into a (perforated?) drawer placed on a lower floor, under the RC?



You have built the version 1 KKTO roaster
Although it?s a better design for heat distribution, it did have safety concerns e.g. heat burns

That?s why I redesigned it using the 2 pot system
The newer V2 design is safer and easier to build

I have mentioned it before that I have about 22 different design ideas for the roaster
Many of them are beyond DIY
Some are advanced heat units and load and drop to cool beans

Most would agree that I have always shared my ideas freely for coffee enthusiasts

However to this day after a 10 + year reliability record of the design - no one has approached me to jointly develop a commercial roaster
I don?t necessarily want money for it, a tiny percentage of sales would be enough - but what?s a non negotiable is to give recognition to the designer

It?s highly probable that the Boca Boca uses some of the design ideas of the KKTO and also HRO member farmroasts ideas - but I assume that it?s a business venture to sell roasting machines.
The question is - Do they understand the nuances of coffee

KK
I home roast and I like it. Designer of the KKTO
Roaster Build information
https://homeroast...ad_id=1142

https://docs.goog...lide=id.i0
Blog - http://koffeekosm...gspot.com/

Bezzera Strega, Mazzer Robur Grinder, Pullman Tamper Convex,
(KKTO) Turbo Oven Home Roaster.
 
Web
renatoa
Top  #11 Print Post
Posted on 07/10/2020 4:16 AM
Not sure how much this was addressed to me, and how much to Boca Boca... :confused (missing) icon:

The world is full of nonsense about ideas paternity and who get money from them... just look at Tesla, clearly a stock bubble without any support in real business.

Or, in our field, the Stronghold machine, that also share a lot of DNA with TO concepts.

I built my machine before joining here and heard about KK design.
First TO designs I seen were those using a SC base.
Even so, our shops aren't selling these types of pasta pots, so for me the heart of the design was the Ikea flat ikea steamer insert, easier to find, already widely used in our home roaster community to mimic pro roasters cooling trays.
 
Koffee Kosmo
Top  #12 Print Post
Posted on 07/10/2020 5:05 AM
So you built your roaster up to 14 years ago
Is that correct
I don?t know your background at all - so I will just post a rough timeline

Although I posted it to the world of DIY approx 12 years ago the original design and first build is actually over 14 years old

Farmroasts idea was probably over 16 years ago ?but need to check? and the Boca is closer to his design as he does not use the perforated pot.
And I did acknowledge as a matter of principle on the original thread that I used his heat method along with my design thoughts because I did not want to build a bread machine with heat gun

KK
I home roast and I like it. Designer of the KKTO
Roaster Build information
https://homeroast...ad_id=1142

https://docs.goog...lide=id.i0
Blog - http://koffeekosm...gspot.com/

Bezzera Strega, Mazzer Robur Grinder, Pullman Tamper Convex,
(KKTO) Turbo Oven Home Roaster.
 
Web
renatoa
Top  #13 Print Post
Posted on 07/10/2020 6:24 AM
Not so far in the past, but there is no need ...

Without knowing the term "kosmo" someone can't find any reference to your builds, even today, nor last year, nor ... years ago...
A search for "turbo oven coffee roasting" in Google returns no results... about kkto or kosmo. Absolutely no occurrence of these words.
At least in the first page... who press next today for google searches ? Grin
So, how do you suppose someone interested to build such machine could find about your design and steal it ?

Interesting I didn't seen such IP claims in the FB or drum forums, but only here...
 
Koffee Kosmo
Top  #14 Print Post
Posted on 07/10/2020 8:17 AM

Quote

renatoa wrote:

Not so far in the past, but there is no need ...

Without knowing the term "kosmo" someone can't find any reference to your builds, even today, nor last year, nor ... years ago...
A search for "turbo oven coffee roasting" in Google returns no results... about kkto or kosmo. Absolutely no occurrence of these words.
At least in the first page... who press next today for google searches ? Grin
So, how do you suppose someone interested to build such machine could find about your design and steal it ?

Interesting I didn't seen such IP claims in the FB or drum forums, but only here...



That?s a bit strange as everyone knows me
And I have a combined post count of over 8000 in all the forums that I am a member
Also in the background I help people that contact me on a regular basis ( sometimes daily ) to build roasters and or find solutions based on the parts they can source

On the link below you will see my first Thread and post from when I first joined HRO ? and that was my roaster design

https://forum.hom...ad_id=1142

https://forum.homeroasters.org/forum/viewthread.php?thread_id=1142



All itemised heading information about all things coffee from brewing to building a roaster is located on the Discussion Forum section ( it?s a catalogue of every category we could think of )
We older members had a hand in developing it

Further more I have a link in my signature of my blogspot
I also have information on google docks - https://docs.goog...lide=id.i7

https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1H0RshF6QP8hNSBEbTTjDKLvAumuW5nHt5KfvU9i2Xqs/embed?slide=id.i0

And I have a small presence on Facebook and a few videos on YouTube

KK
Edited by JackH on 07/11/2020 4:26 PM
I home roast and I like it. Designer of the KKTO
Roaster Build information
https://homeroast...ad_id=1142

https://docs.goog...lide=id.i0
Blog - http://koffeekosm...gspot.com/

Bezzera Strega, Mazzer Robur Grinder, Pullman Tamper Convex,
(KKTO) Turbo Oven Home Roaster.
 
Web
JackH
Top  #15 Print Post
Posted on 07/10/2020 11:34 AM
Who is this Kosmo character I have been hearing about?
---Jack

KKTO Roaster.
 
Koffee Kosmo
Top  #16 Print Post
Posted on 07/10/2020 5:56 PM

Quote

JackH wrote:

Who is this Kosmo character I have been hearing about?


I?m the man from down under
GDay all
I?m a roaster holic

KK
I home roast and I like it. Designer of the KKTO
Roaster Build information
https://homeroast...ad_id=1142

https://docs.goog...lide=id.i0
Blog - http://koffeekosm...gspot.com/

Bezzera Strega, Mazzer Robur Grinder, Pullman Tamper Convex,
(KKTO) Turbo Oven Home Roaster.
 
Web
renatoa
Top  #17 Print Post
Posted on 03/11/2022 8:36 AM
Could this Italian roaster be inside something close to Bova V2 / turbine cyclonic oven ?

http://www.aromat...ne-en.html

This vague description of how it works...

Quote

...thanks to a stream of hot air generated electrically


... points to such conclusion.
 
CK
Top  #18 Print Post
Posted on 03/11/2022 1:14 PM
Love the Italian aesthetics. Nice find!Grin

Found this 2016 video of it... didn't know it was created many years ago.
Edited by CK on 03/11/2022 1:38 PM
 
renatoa
Top  #19 Print Post
Posted on 03/12/2022 3:30 AM
Italian smoke and mirrors... reveals nothing in 4 minutes... if you want more, show your money Grin

From the Boca video someone can build one, from Aromatech can't figure more than "load beans, press a button"
Edited by renatoa on 03/12/2022 2:27 PM
 
zamunda
Top  #20 Print Post
Posted on 03/17/2022 2:37 PM
Hello,

I would like to start with a TO-roaster...what would be a good starting-point?

Would this model be ok?


Thanks and regards,
zamunda attached the following image:
to.jpg
########################
### A lot can happen over coffee ###
########################
 
Web
Koffee Kosmo
Top  #21 Print Post
Posted on 03/18/2022 9:33 PM
The higher the wattage TO the better
Look for a 1400 watts version if available in the US

KK
I home roast and I like it. Designer of the KKTO
Roaster Build information
https://homeroast...ad_id=1142

https://docs.goog...lide=id.i0
Blog - http://koffeekosm...gspot.com/

Bezzera Strega, Mazzer Robur Grinder, Pullman Tamper Convex,
(KKTO) Turbo Oven Home Roaster.
 
Web
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