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Enhancing My HotTop (5 of 5) ? Advanced Modifications
ronsil
When I last spoke to Shelly (Hottop,Taiwan) about it she was talking 700/900 grams.

They are playing this arrival very close to their chest.
Ron
 
smico
Ideally we should try not to cool down the drum between the roasts, just the motor and electronics.
How about some air intake that will be sealed during the roast.
Or instead of blowing the air from the front, blow fresh air from the back through the fan. Cooling will be much more efficient.

Another important observation from my experiment is that beans should be cooled externally. If you cool them on the HT tray, it will take much longer to cool everything down to safe temperatures.
Hottop B2 + HTC, Cremina 83, OE Pharos, Brewtus IIIR, Baratza Vario
 
snwcmpr
I think I will have to make one, I probably can't afford one.

Ken
--------------
Backwoods Roaster
"I wish I could taste as well as I wish I could roast."

As Abraham Lincoln said "Do not trust everything you read on the internet".
 
ciel-007
Miroslav, thanks for posting a wonderful graph illustrating the many thermal peaks and valleys that the HT experienced during your roasting marathon.

Do you recall what was the average temperature displayed on the HT?s Control Panel when you were about to launch each follow-up roast? Also, do you remember the average amount of time that elapsed between the moment when the roasted beans were ejected into the cooling tray, and the moment when the next batch of green beans was dropped down the chute?

Keep up the excellent work, Ciel
Ciel... seeking Heaven in my cup with ................................................................................................................. EXPOBAR Brewtus II - MAZZER Mini E - MAHLK?NIG Vario - GeneCafe - RAF-1 Extreme (Modified B-2 HOTTOP) - BellaTaiwan XJ-101
 
smico

Quote

ciel-007 wrote:
Do you recall what was the average temperature displayed on the HT?s Control Panel when you were about to launch each follow-up roast?
I don't look at the panel, but next time I will check it out and let you know.

Quote

ciel-007 wrote:
Also, do you remember the average amount of time that elapsed between the moment when the roasted beans were ejected into the cooling tray, and the moment when the next batch of green beans was dropped down the chute?
Some 16 minutes is the temperature between eject and next load.

I loaded logs of all 9 roasts in this CSV file, so that you can analyze it. You also have first crack temperatures in the same file.

Since I started using 9 minutes cooling cycle, I never reached 428F Hottop max temp alarm.
smico attached the following file:
b2b_9_roasts_20121202.zip [12.24kB / 546 Downloads]

Hottop B2 + HTC, Cremina 83, OE Pharos, Brewtus IIIR, Baratza Vario
 
snwcmpr
I am curious. What do you mean by 9 minute cooling cycle, and how do you get that?
Ken in NC
--------------
Backwoods Roaster
"I wish I could taste as well as I wish I could roast."

As Abraham Lincoln said "Do not trust everything you read on the internet".
 
smico

Quote

snwcmpr wrote:

I am curious. What do you mean by 9 minute cooling cycle, and how do you get that?
Ken in NC
Ken, your power blower technique works much better than my current procedure.

Goal is to cool down drum motor under 60C, and based on my measurements it takes 9 minutes to achieve that in my garage.

I am working on some additional features of Ciel's manual fan modification, so I currently improvise:
1. When Hottop stops, I start new roast just to trigger additional cooling down to 165 on display.
2. Once I hit 165, Hottop starts the new roast. If I need additional cooling, I just open the chaff tray.
Hottop B2 + HTC, Cremina 83, OE Pharos, Brewtus IIIR, Baratza Vario
 
snwcmpr
Oh, I somehow thought you were doing something else. That was so obvious, i didn't even think of that.
LOL!!!!

At least with the vacuum cleaner method, I can walk away.
You have a new roast starting when the temp hits 165 F.
Thank you,
Ken in NC
--------------
Backwoods Roaster
"I wish I could taste as well as I wish I could roast."

As Abraham Lincoln said "Do not trust everything you read on the internet".
 
ciel-007

Quote

smico wrote:

I loaded logs of all 9 roasts in this CSV file, so that you can analyze it. You also have first crack temperatures in the same file. Since I started using 9 minutes cooling cycle, I never reached 428F Hottop max temp alarm.


Miroslav, thank you for posting the 31 page log from your recent marathon roasting session ? that level of detail is much appreciated.

If I understand correctly, your conducted 9 back to back roasts lasting almost 5 hours. During the marathon, you monitored the thermal environment of the Main Motor and of the Main Circuit Board with the objective of avoiding temperature extremes that might cause them to fail prematurely. You also described a back to back roasting/ cooling technique that should avoid harming those components.

Here is my summary of your key points as I have understood them so far:
-Average time per roast is approximately 14 minutes
-Wait at least 9 minutes after ejecting beans before starting next roast
-During the 9 minutes remove back filter to maximize component cooling
-During your 9 roasts Main Motor temperature did not exceed 189F (86C)
-During the 9 roasts Circuit Board temperature did not exceeded 86F (30C)

I too am conducting similar thermal trials on my HotTop.
My objectives are to:
-further reduce the 9 minute delay period between roasts
-hold the roasting chamber at temperatures higher than 165F
-protect Main Board & Motor from harmful temperature extremes
-further reduce overall back to back roasting times.

I plan to post those trial results soon.
Ciel... seeking Heaven in my cup with ................................................................................................................. EXPOBAR Brewtus II - MAZZER Mini E - MAHLK?NIG Vario - GeneCafe - RAF-1 Extreme (Modified B-2 HOTTOP) - BellaTaiwan XJ-101
 
smico
Ciel,

During the cooling phase we should cool the motor with fresh outside air, not the hot air from the drum. This will keep drum hot, and cool the drum motor to safe starting temperatures.

I first had an idea of running fan in reverse, but techically this is not easy, and anyway stock fan is uni-directional.

I though about few ideas:
1. Find bi-derectional fan with regular DC motor
2. Phisically turn fan during the cooling phase - screws should be replace with some easy attachments
3. Make a hole in the bean chute and push cool air directly to the motor.

Any other ideas?
Hottop B2 + HTC, Cremina 83, OE Pharos, Brewtus IIIR, Baratza Vario
 
snwcmpr
I think the cooling fan should not be designed to feed the hot air through the motor area. Not only is it hot air, but the smoke leaves its residue in that area. I am still trying to picture a solution, I have only recently noticed that as a problem, after a cleaning session.
Something to consider if I ever make a roaster.

Ken
--------------
Backwoods Roaster
"I wish I could taste as well as I wish I could roast."

As Abraham Lincoln said "Do not trust everything you read on the internet".
 
smico
I agree with you Ken. Quest M3 design is better in that regard.
Hottop B2 + HTC, Cremina 83, OE Pharos, Brewtus IIIR, Baratza Vario
 
snwcmpr
I wonder if the new one is the same?
Ken
--------------
Backwoods Roaster
"I wish I could taste as well as I wish I could roast."

As Abraham Lincoln said "Do not trust everything you read on the internet".
 
ronsil

Quote

snwcmpr wrote:
I wonder if the new one is the same?


Now thats the BIG Question. What do we know about the 'Biggy'

Any more news your side than here?
Ron
 
smico
Through my long roasting sessions it became obvious that, provided that beans are cooled externally, only drum motor is at risk during back to back roasts with regular cooling cycle.

If we were to separately cool the motor with, for example, closed water cooling system, there would be no need for pause between the roasts.
Hottop B2 + HTC, Cremina 83, OE Pharos, Brewtus IIIR, Baratza Vario
 
smico
I installed manual fan switch, with slight modification: in manual mode fan is connected to external power source. This adds more wires, but it gives me more room for play as it's completely independent circuit.

I changed my roasting routine:
1. Roast
2. Eject
3. Fan on manual, take the filter out
4. Take the beans to external cooler
(At this point temperatures of both drum motor and electronics are shooting up as selenoid keeps the bean eject door on the back wall open, and heat easily leaks behind the backwall).
4. Press POWER on HT display as soon as it shows up - power the HT off.
(Temperature of the motor now changes at rate of -4C per minute, which allows for 7 minutes cool down to bring the motor under 60C)
5. Prepare the HT for the next session: vacuum the chaff, save log, load template for the next roast
6. 7 minutes after end of previous roast, set fan to auto and start new roast.

13 minutes roasting and 7 minutes cooling allow almost 3 roasts per hour.
My goal is close to 4 roasts per hour.

Miroslav
Hottop B2 + HTC, Cremina 83, OE Pharos, Brewtus IIIR, Baratza Vario
 
snwcmpr
What do you do with all this coffee you are roasting?
My wife and I use 60 grams per day, maybe an extra cup later in the day.
That is 3.5 days per 1/2 pound of green beans.
If I do 3 roasts in a day, that's a week + of coffee.

But, thanks so much for all this information. It really is worthwhile in my 'newbee' opinion.

Ken in NC
--------------
Backwoods Roaster
"I wish I could taste as well as I wish I could roast."

As Abraham Lincoln said "Do not trust everything you read on the internet".
 
smico

Quote

snwcmpr wrote:
What do you do with all this coffee you are roasting?

Friends, family, hair-dresser, co-workers... Once they try it, they are hooked. We have similar personal consumption: between 60 - 100 grams a day.
Hottop B2 + HTC, Cremina 83, OE Pharos, Brewtus IIIR, Baratza Vario
 
smico

Quote

smico wrote:

Quote

snwcmpr wrote:
What do you do with all this coffee you are roasting?

Friends, family, hair-dresser, co-workers... Once they try it, they are hooked. We have similar personal consumption: between 60 - 100 grams a day.
And I buy coffee at Green Coffee Buying Club. Grat people, great coffees, but dangerous place for green stash growth. I linger around 200 lbs of some 50 varieties of coffees.
That is why I am looking to do additional advanced modification and install higher fins in my Hottop to be able to roast 300 g.
Anyone installed higher fins in HT?
Miroslav
Hottop B2 + HTC, Cremina 83, OE Pharos, Brewtus IIIR, Baratza Vario
 
ciel-007

Quote

smico wrote:

... I am looking to do additional advanced modification and install higher fins in my Hottop to be able to roast 300 g. Anyone installed higher fins in HT?


I regularly roast 300 gram batches with unmodified fins. That yields around 2 lbs of great coffee in about an hour.
Ciel... seeking Heaven in my cup with ................................................................................................................. EXPOBAR Brewtus II - MAZZER Mini E - MAHLK?NIG Vario - GeneCafe - RAF-1 Extreme (Modified B-2 HOTTOP) - BellaTaiwan XJ-101
 
snwcmpr
Ciel,
Could you send me a profile of the roast of a 300 gram batch?
My roasts that large took so long, it was baked, so i just do 225 grams.
Ken in NC
--------------
Backwoods Roaster
"I wish I could taste as well as I wish I could roast."

As Abraham Lincoln said "Do not trust everything you read on the internet".
 
ciel-007

Quote

snwcmpr wrote:

... could you send me a profile of the roast of a 300 gram batch?...


Ken, check your PMs. Happy roasting! Ciel
Ciel... seeking Heaven in my cup with ................................................................................................................. EXPOBAR Brewtus II - MAZZER Mini E - MAHLK?NIG Vario - GeneCafe - RAF-1 Extreme (Modified B-2 HOTTOP) - BellaTaiwan XJ-101
 
PhluX

Quote

ciel-007 wrote:

Cracking the ?165F Barrier?:

When Might Breaking the ?428F Ceiling? be Useful?


I just did the "Cracking the ?165F Barrier?" mod.
Thanks for making me aware of this solution. I can now roast a new batch immediately after the beans have cooled and no longer have to wait ca. 5 minutes for the chamber to cool. Very much appreciated.

I installed a flick switch for the mod and have tried the "Breaking the ?428F Ceiling? as described above. What I find is that when I turn off the temperature sensor for more than about 2-3 seconds the beans eject. So for my Hottop this mod is not available. I have the Hottop KN8828B-2.

I am happy with this mod anyway, as "Cracking the ?165F Barrier?" was my primary target. Just wanted to let you all know that the Hottop KN8828B-2 is not succesfull with the "Breaking the ?428F Ceiling?" mod :)
 
smico

Quote

PhluX wrote:
I can now roast a new batch immediately after the beans have cooled and no longer have to wait ca. 5 minutes for the chamber to cool. Very much appreciated.

PhluX,
You might want to be careful with drum motor as its temperature will build up and go over 100C after just few back-to-back roasts.
Please let me know if you need more info, but if you read complete thread you can see some mods, or roasting routines that will help to avoid buildup.
Cheers,
Miroslav
Hottop B2 + HTC, Cremina 83, OE Pharos, Brewtus IIIR, Baratza Vario
 
farmroast
A fin modification is quite beneficial.
see this and the related thread.
http://www.home-b...n%20hottop
Ed B.
DreamRoast 1kg roaster, Levers, Hand Mills http://coffee-roa...gspot.com/
 
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