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Dimmer *FIXED* -- Now... Not Enough Heat
CharcoalRoaster
Top  #1 Print Post
Posted on 11/19/2018 6:20 AM
So I swapped out the dimmer and now I actually have dimmer control enough to loft at least 100g of greens. However, I ran through a test batch and definitely couldn't get enough heat.

After 3-4 min there was no color change at all. I wasn't reading temps yet as I haven't installed a thermocouple (was waiting on shipment).

How much do these popper elements draw? Maybe I need to run it on a different circuit in my garage???

Or, is the Presto Poplite just an underperformer in the heat category?
 
JackH
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Posted on 11/19/2018 7:32 AM
The presto documentation says it is 1440W. It should be OK. Double check your heating element wiring using the link I supplied in the other thread. Make sure you do not run the heating elements without the fan running. It can burn out the heating coil.

Most people find that the popper heat is too strong and results in a roast that it too short.

Do you get any heat at all when running?
---Jack

KKTO Roaster.
 
CharcoalRoaster
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Posted on 11/19/2018 8:21 AM
I'll double check but I'm pretty positive I have it wired up ok.

Yes, I had heat but it never really got *hot*. I'll stick a temp probe in there today to see what max heat its putting out.
 
renatoa
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Posted on 11/19/2018 8:43 AM
Maybe it was initially intended for 220-230V... using at 110V result will be 1/4 of rated power, thus 360W...
 
CharcoalRoaster
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Posted on 11/19/2018 9:09 AM
I doubt that as 220-230v is really quite rare in small commercial appliances in the US.

Just ran the fan for about a couple of minutes with heat on...

Full fan power maxed out at 116*F

Half fan power maxed out at 120*F

I'll go back and check my internal wiring. Any other things I can examine? I grabbed this stupid thing because it seemed like a simple little build - no such thing as a simple little build I suppose BBQ grill
 
renatoa
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Posted on 11/19/2018 10:06 AM
Back to initial factory wiring, without dimmer, you should have FC in 3-4 minutes and charcoaled in 6 minutes. So you know your popper is ok.
Then place the dimmer on heater only, max fan, and check if you can reach 3-400F with the dimmer.
Air control comes last.
 
CharcoalRoaster
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Posted on 11/19/2018 1:35 PM
Ah, I *think* I found my problem and it is thanks to Chicago John's link in his original build to this youtube video https://www.youtu...4KXvGZOivA where in the comment section he mentions that his hot wire was red and not black. I believe mine is the same way.

Here's a link to the picture of my heating coil wires for the poplite https://www.dropb...1.JPG?dl=0

If I understand everything correctly based on a comparison of the wiring diagram presented in the video and the wiring in my unit I need to swap the red and black wires to where my red is actually the main hot and the black is the secondary coil that should be connected with/to the netural (white)?

Is this correct before I plug it in and melt everything?
 
renatoa
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Posted on 11/19/2018 2:34 PM
In that video white wire is the neutral, but in some poppers white is the low voltage "pinch" for the motor... this must be clarified before the melt job Grin
 
JackH
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Posted on 11/19/2018 5:57 PM
It seems like the thermostat has not been bypassed and is still working (limiting your heat output).

What is usually done is a wire is added to go across the thermostat.

Do you have a photo of what your wiring looks like now?
---Jack

KKTO Roaster.
 
renatoa
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Posted on 11/20/2018 12:56 AM
The thermostat, for poppers I moded so far, cut the power at 180 C, and resume at about 160C.
This is enough for a nice drying to yellowing phase.
The value should be in the same ballpark worldwide, because popcorn don't pop if temperature is under 150C, I know because tried to roast popcorn in the coffee roaster machine, with "profiles" Grin At least for corn sold here in EU...
 
CharcoalRoaster
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Posted on 11/20/2018 7:42 AM

Quote

JackH wrote:

It seems like the thermostat has not been bypassed and is still working (limiting your heat output).

What is usually done is a wire is added to go across the thermostat.

Do you have a photo of what your wiring looks like now?


Yeah, I didn't mess with it because the Youtube video mod says there's no need to bypass as lonmg as the wiring is correct. I was just matching up wire colors in the attempt to be safe but, after reading Johns build thread, I may have only wired power to one or the other coils and not both. I'll try to snap some pics here in the next couple of days.
 
CharcoalRoaster
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Posted on 11/23/2018 2:54 PM
So I've got the heat issue resolved. I was only energizing the inner heating coil which was giving me low temps. After rewiring not I'm having the reverse issue with temps going from 0-250*F in under a minute.

Clearly, this rate of rise is way too fast and the temp is way too high. I tried loading up the hopper with 100g of greens but couldn't achieve the necessary circulation. I pulled and dumped the beans after a min or so because I knew I would have half burned half green beans.

I supposed I'm going to need to hardwire in some type of controller for the heating coils in order to control both heat and airfow?

What controllers have popcorn roasters used successfully in this area?
 
renatoa
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Posted on 11/23/2018 3:01 PM
I don't think this rate of rise is that fast... in Diechmann Roastmeister I reach 400F in a minute.
Actually, when you load in a drum the greens are discarded into a 400F/200C environment in seconds.
The problem is if temperature continue to raise same rate beyond 400F... instead a slower rate, of about 40F per minute, reaching 520F about minute 4, and stopping there.

And for this last job you really need a controller... but a dimmer could work for the start as well.
Edited by renatoa on 11/23/2018 3:10 PM
 
CharcoalRoaster
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Posted on 11/23/2018 3:24 PM
I went ahead and bought the same variable speed controller I used on my 500g fluidbed roaster so I'm sure it will be fine.

The temp in the middle of the bean mass on your roaster is at 400* within a minute? I've never heard of a roaster that has bean mass readings that high that fast...

With that said, I've never roasted on a drum roaster commercial or otherwise.
 
renatoa
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Posted on 11/23/2018 3:29 PM
Nope, in air, not bean mass.

Apply to you too, measuring real BT in fluid bed machines is a mess, you mainly measure air.
Especially in a popper, where the air is not focused in a column, but blowing in a vortex in the whole small volume.
 
CharcoalRoaster
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Posted on 11/23/2018 3:52 PM
Oh ok, that makes more sense. Curiosity got the best of me and I just ran a 100g load through an entire roast. Certainly a melange roast but not as bad as I would have thought. Had to keep the roaster tipped at a 30* angle-ish throughout the roast. Didn't time this one but based on feel it seemed like a 7-8min profile. Dumped around FC.

I'll see in the morning how it tastes. My question is now whether or not that controller for heat would really make a difference in improving the roast profile?
 
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