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11/26/2020 6:37 AM
Everyone have a super Thanksgiving and may all your roasts turn out stellar woohoo

11/25/2020 4:20 PM
Howdy 1st CH and welcome to HR forum! Be sure to read in the forums to see if anything covers the topic and please post away in drum roaster forums Welcome

11/25/2020 3:35 PM
Hey everyone! I am new to the home roasters forum. Mainly here to read and learn! I’d also love to get advice about modifying my roaster (a Huky 500)

11/10/2020 5:29 PM
Welcome MJ, post away! Cheers

11/08/2020 6:05 PM
Hello All, New here, started with an air popper, now using fresh roast 800. I'm here to learn and connect with others Thank you

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DASH Popper - Working Great
renatoa
AWG18 is what I have stock for all my jobs, either hobby or house related.
AWG20 is the minimum you can use for your current in a popper.
Must be insulated in fiberglass cloth, or 400 C degrees rated silicone.
Coffeeed

Quote

renatoa wrote:

AWG18 is what I have stock for all my jobs, either hobby or house related.
AWG20 is the minimum you can use for your current in a popper.
Must be insulated in fiberglass cloth, or 400 C degrees rated silicone.


Would there be danger in using bare wire?

Wrapping the thermostat closed would be the simplest solution using a thin bare copper at the edge where the top strip is not attached to the lower strip.

Thoughts?
renatoa
Nope, actually the heater is bare wire... all those crimped terminals on the plate are non insulated too...
If stable and no chance to unwrap due to vibrations, then it's safe.
Coffeeed

Quote

renatoa wrote:

Nope, actually the heater is bare wire... all those crimped terminals on the plate are non insulated too...
If stable and no chance to unwrap due to vibrations, then it's safe.


Wire wrapping that strip down didn’t defeat the temperature-related shutoff. I guess I need to bypass it entirely.
Coffeeed
Turns out the thermal cutoff is on the barrel of the popper and is easily bypassed by snipping the wires on splicing them with a wire nut.
renatoa
This is weird... then what is the purpose of bimetal in the heater plate ?

I would keep uncut the crimping of the barrel thermostat wires, would help you for SSR connection Grin
Coffeeed

Quote

renatoa wrote:

This is weird... then what is the purpose of bimetal in the heater plate ?

I would keep uncut the crimping of the barrel thermostat wires, would help you for SSR connection Grin


It is surprising that it has both the barrel thermostat and the one on the heating plate. Now that I look at it. The one on the heating plate will turn the primary heating coil on/off without shutting off the fan Or the secondary heating coil while the barrel thermostat shuts off all power.

Can you explain more what you mean “ I would keep uncut the crimping of the barrel thermostat wires, ”
renatoa

Quote

Coffeeed wrote:

Can you explain more what you mean “ I would keep uncut the crimping of the barrel thermostat wires, ”


How do you plan to control the power/temperature?
Variator, computer controlled, etc... either method assume the usage on an electronic switch (SSR) placed in series with the heater. i.e. exactly instead the barrel thermostat.
Thus you can use the thermostat original crimped terminals, to avoid other soldering or tinkering.
Coffeeed

Quote

renatoa wrote:

Quote

Coffeeed wrote:

Can you explain more what you mean “ I would keep uncut the crimping of the barrel thermostat wires, ”


How do you plan to control the power/temperature?
Variator, computer controlled, etc... either method assume the usage on an electronic switch (SSR) placed in series with the heater. i.e. exactly instead the barrel thermostat.
Thus you can use the thermostat original crimped terminals, to avoid other soldering or tinkering.


Thanks. I am not planning on controlling the temperature/power at this time. Though I might want to put in a switch to turn off the heater in order to be able to use the fan to cool off the beans in the popper.

But as a clarification, I don't think that the thermostat on the barrel can be used to control the heater independent of the fan. That barrel thermostat shuts off electricity to the heater and fan. If I am not mistaken, I think it is the the circuit path that the other thermostat is on (the one on the heater plate) to control the heater separate from the fan.
renatoa
After motor separation there is no more "heater and/or fan", is just heater, the motor will be on its own power source. So both thermostats will do the same job.

You can't roast with a popper without reducing power, will have charcoal in 2-3 minutes.
You need at least two power steps for an accurate roast, about 50% for drying, and about 70-80% for the crack/development phase.
Permanent maximum heat applied is way too much. I mean 100%, i.e. thermostat bypassed.
I am not aware about any setup using a popper and driving a successful roast with 100% power.
"Much to learn, you still have." my dear Grin
jkoll42

Quote

renatoa wrote:

I am not aware about any setup using a popper and driving a successful roast with 100% power.
"Much to learn, you still have." my dear Grin


It's actually a very common first step into roasting to use a unmodified popper. Sweetmarias has a simple guide right under their resources section. I started this way probably 20 years and 9 roasters ago. You can absolutely get good roasts as long as you carefully monitor roast development after the approximate 3 minute drying phase since it goes pretty fast after that. Will they be as complex and nuanced a roast as a custom built rig where you have complete control of heat etc? No, but it's still better than most commercial stuff on the shelf of the store. Adding resistance with long extension cords helps, separating heat and fan with a light dimmer or router speed control is even better but you can still get OK roasts with a bone stock popper.

Usually I wouldn't post the below but I hate the idea of discouraging any potential homeroasters with the thought that unless they are running a PID'd custom rig made with 3D printed parts (that is all awesome though!) they can forget about getting a decent roast.

"Much to learn, you still have" my dear roar


<<I think G would smile down on the T-Rex use>>
-Jon
Honey badger 1k, Bunn LPG-2E, Technivorm, Cimbali Max Hybrid, Vibiemme Double Domo V3
renatoa
Who wrote about a PID ? I wouldn't advise anyone to use a PID for coffee roasting, unless it is a ramp-soak model.
But a $12 variator, able to display and change power at % level, can indeed reward you with right done roasts, even without thermometer.

No idea about the build of US roasters, but those common in Europe literally charcoal your beans in 3 minutes, if thermostat is bypassed.
Drying phase is gone about 1:30, no way to extend it to 3 minutes without voltage lowering by whatever method.
I can do a movie. Surely far from any level of roast decency.

Here the first level of roast we advise beginners is in pan, on the stove.

Surely, when fan is separate you can apply more voltage, increase airflow, the temperature will decrease, also allowing more load, and you can have a chance... but this is no more an unmodified popper.
Coffeeed

Quote

renatoa wrote:

After motor separation there is no more "heater and/or fan", is just heater, the motor will be on its own power source. So both thermostats will do the same job.

You can't roast with a popper without reducing power, will have charcoal in 2-3 minutes.
You need at least two power steps for an accurate roast, about 50% for drying, and about 70-80% for the crack/development phase.
Permanent maximum heat applied is way too much. I mean 100%, i.e. thermostat bypassed.
I am not aware about any setup using a popper and driving a successful roast with 100% power.
"Much to learn, you still have." my dear Grin


Your comment that "You can't roast with a popper without reducing power, will have charcoal in 2-3 minutes. "

Is simply incorrect. I have been roasting with poppers for close to 20 years. With the current popper, there is about 4 to 5 minutes (with a 140 grams load) before onset of first crack (ambient temperature being a factor in how long it takes to get there) and a couple of minutes before the onset of second crack.

No charcoal. Or anything like it.

What you say may be true of SOME poppers but not any of the ones that I have used. And there are plenty of others in the same boat.

I decided not to go with a fancier setup when I compared my results to roasts produced by 'craft roasters'. The difference was not huge.
jkoll42
renatoa - I was simply using PID as one example of modifications/custom setups that are not necessary for a simple entry level roast. Perhaps the Euro popcorn poppers are significantly different but I doubt it.

Keep in mind that roast loads also have a significant effect on roast progression with poppers. A low load slows down the roast while a larger load will make it faster.

With his experience Coffeeed would have more knowledge with the longer time roasting poppers. I used them for a couple years and then moved to HG/BM and then all sorts of rediculousness!
-Jon
Honey badger 1k, Bunn LPG-2E, Technivorm, Cimbali Max Hybrid, Vibiemme Double Domo V3
renatoa
A fellow was been intrigued about this debate here and came today bringing with him a new popper, to show him what's the buzz about.
The load was been 70 grams, the maximum that that popper was been capable to barely move at start.
On the popper carton box I can read "up to 60 grams popcorn in 2 minutes" Is this a standard machine? Are these machines different sizes ?
We agreed to not help at all the initial movement, with a spoon or other methods, to see the real popper capability.
The beans turned yellow under minute 1, start turning more vigorously, and the 180 C thermostat switched off about minute two, so we must wait cooling to resume the roast. At that moment already having some beans into FC. Without the thermostat protection I am sure they would be into SC by minute three, as happened with another similar poppers I moded in the past, after removing the protection.
I can't imagine how a stock popper can be loaded with 140 grams, and not overspill after drying, without doing a roast chamber extension. The unit used in test today thrown outside some beans even at 70 grams, at the end of the roast.
We are talking about unmodified poppers, right?

For the second test I did a minimal external change, the popper being still unmodified: reduced the power at 50% with the diode trick.
For this test we helped the movement during dry with a wood spoon. The beans were able to move by themselves about minute two.
In this case the roast was been indeed more reasonable, with drying ending in the minute 3 ballpark, FC start at 5-6, and drop at minute 7, without any protection trip. We dare to drink from the second roast and was been ok.

I still stand that roasting with an unmodified popper, without power reduction, is a beans torture.
In a really well done machine, TC4-ised on steroids, used as pro sampler, the power profile ramp from 20 to 75%, for 60 grams of greens.

This is the test popper I wrote above:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILbpq...Lbpqh22WVk
Edited by renatoa on 10/07/2020 2:29 PM
renatoa
After 20 years of roasting with poppers, any model, finding and annihilating a thermostat, any model, should not be so complicate as it was...

For me the first popper experience was been enough to label them as nice to try once, as a starting wet the feet into coffee roasting, and quickly pass to other level.
Coffeeed

Quote

renatoa wrote:

A fellow was been intrigued about this debate here and came today bringing with him a new popper, to show him what's the buzz about.
The load was been 70 grams, the maximum that that popper was been capable to barely move at start.
On the popper carton box I can read "up to 60 grams popcorn in 2 minutes" Is this a standard machine? Are these machines different sizes ?
We agreed to not help at all the initial movement, with a spoon or other methods, to see the real popper capability.
The beans turned yellow under minute 1, start turning more vigorously, and the 180 C thermostat switched off about minute two, so we must wait cooling to resume the roast. At that moment already having some beans into FC. Without the thermostat protection I am sure they would be into SC by minute three, as happened with another similar poppers I moded in the past, after removing the protection.
I can't imagine how a stock popper can be loaded with 140 grams, and not overspill after drying, without doing a roast chamber extension. The unit used in test today thrown outside some beans even at 70 grams, at the end of the roast.
We are talking about unmodified poppers, right?

For the second test I did a minimal external change, the popper being still unmodified: reduced the power at 50% with the diode trick.
For this test we helped the movement during dry with a wood spoon. The beans were able to move by themselves about minute two.
In this case the roast was been indeed more reasonable, with drying ending in the minute 3 ballpark, FC start at 5-6, and drop at minute 7, without any protection trip. We dare to drink from the second roast and was been ok.

I still stand that roasting with an unmodified popper, without power reduction, is a beans torture.
In a really well done machine, TC4-ised on steroids, used as pro sampler, the power profile ramp from 20 to 75%, for 60 grams of greens.

This is the test popper I wrote above:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILbpq...Lbpqh22WVk


As you can see from the times that I posted above, your results are radically different from mine with any of the poppers I use. I tried one popper when I first started out that behaved as you describe -- and stopped using it after determining that it would only work properly with some sort of voltage regulation.

But the Poppery II, Popcorn Pumper, Nostalgia and DASH don't work like that and all can do very good roasts once you figure out the correct load.

I wonder if the U.S. being at 120volts rather than Europe's 240v ends up being relevant to the heat characteristics.
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