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homeroaster
10/04/2022 7:11 PM
I'm still alive. Haven't posted here for a while. Still roasting about 20 lb a week. Life is good. Find me on Facebook.

allenb
10/03/2022 3:29 PM
carloswlkr Welcome

allenb
10/03/2022 12:06 PM
HI Michael, go to consumer zone, java trading company and first post is basic rules. PM me with any needed clarifications. Cheers

Michael Kirkpatrick
10/03/2022 11:47 AM
Good morning! what would be the best way to post a coffee roaster for sale? Thanks

renatoa
10/03/2022 2:12 AM
@ittiponcr and welcome cup adrianalindgren

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Rewire 230V popcorn machine fan & heater
Ploni
I'd like to rewire my new generic 230V popcorn machine so that its fan will run continuously with plug-in and its On-Off switch will control its heating element.

I got the idea here:

Thing is, my 230V machine's wiring is more complex.

Anyone familiar with such a project and can help?

Thanks.
Edited by renatoa on 10/18/2021 1:41 PM
 
renatoa
What machine? a innards picture, to figure the complexity ?

I moded so far three different poppers sold by EU Lidl shop chain, labels Silvercrest and Zilan, and they are manageable as complexity.
 
Ploni
Thank you. I can try to send more detailed images.
Ploni attached the following images:
230v_generic_edited.jpeg 230v_generic_2_edited.jpeg

Edited by Ploni on 10/18/2021 1:14 PM
 
renatoa
No need for more images, is the familiar wiring of poppers already moded.

First step, disconnect plugs 1-2 from the thermostat, and use those terminals for heater control, ssr or a variator.

Second, free from any wires the PCB pads where I placed the callouts 3 and 4.
For this task unsolder/cut the red wire from pad 3 and insulate it, no more useful, is the motor voltage tap.
Then unsolder/cut the white wires from pad 4 and connect them together, preferably crimping not soldering.
Insulate the join of white wires.
Use the free PCB pads to power the motor from external source.
...
renatoa attached the following image:
230v_generic_2_edited_1.jpeg
 
Ploni
Wow! Thank you SO much, renatoa! I'm gonna start on this tomorrow, God willing.

Can I post again when I need help? For instance, I don't understand your last instruction: "Use the free PCB . . . external source." After this mod I can no longer power the unit from the wall outlet?
 
renatoa
In order to accomplish this part:

Quote

...so that its fan will run continuously with plug-ins...


... the fan have to be powered from an external source, usually 24V with an optional PWM driver, for airflow variation.
The pads 3-4 are where the fan motor voltage should be applied.

The popper shown in the introductory post video uses a different fan motor, powered from mains, not a DC low voltage motor, as those used in European poppers.
The US poppers with high voltage AC motors allows decoupling them from the heater circuit easily, while the EU poppers take the motor voltage from a 19V tap on the heater resistance, and can't operate independently.
Edited by renatoa on 10/18/2021 1:45 PM
 
Ploni
I understand. I think this has gotten too complicated for me.

Should I continue with this project?
 
renatoa
What is the alternative ? Hotgun and a bowl? Pan on a stove ?

Moding a popper is one of the simplest methods to roast coffee... if you want to discover this world.
You can start very rustic, as the guy in the video Grin



No, is not a joke, this is really "fresh roasted coffee" the action happened last week Grin
 
Ploni
OK. You're right.

I'll start on this and get back to you.

Thanks, ren.
 
renatoa
If you give us your location and you want, I can try to make a shopping list for you, as minimal as possible.
 
Ploni
Yes. Thank you very much.

I'm in Jerusalem, Israel.
 
renatoa
Ok, tried some searches, but I can't filter them for Israeli, so I give you just a list of parts that can be found on most electronic stores.
- a fan power source rated to 24V/3A = 72W, like this:
www.ebay.com/itm/...
- a voltage controller like this:
https://www.ebay....4409165886
... or better, the display version, for easier set to a fixed reproducible value:
https://www.ebay....4098593524
... and the heater regulator, again, the digital version:
https://www.ebay....3562878434
 
Ploni
Excellent. Thank you, ren.

If I purchase these parts, can you answer my questions how to install them? (I probably will have a few.)
 
Ploni
Question: Installing all these (4) components is necessary to accomplish the same result as by simply reconnecting one wire in a 120V device?
 
renatoa
Sure, feel free to shot any question.

Not same result, the on-off solution is not what we could call "right" roasting, even if some people could swear on the results they got from such control technique.
But, I admit that I am a bit envious for the motor solution adopted by US market roasters... would make our lives a lot easier. For example, the fan motor could be controlled by a simple $2 light dimmer, instead the 24V source + DC dimmer.
However, regarding heating control I am totally against a manual on-off solution.

Also, please note that, without separating the fan motor and heater circuits, which are partially common for EU models, you are missing a feature that make the fluid bed machines so popular: beans cooling! This is the main point to separate them, not necessarily because of a separate control of them.
Edited by renatoa on 10/19/2021 6:26 AM
 
Ploni
Okay. Thanks, ren.

I'm looking around for a local source for purchasing those components but I suspect I'll have to buy online. Might take a while.

Question: What functionalities does your recommended install provide? What is the procedure to operate such a setup? How does it work?
 
renatoa
The usual fluid bed machine operation start with loading the beans, then raise the airflow until you see the smallest movement of the beans pile.
No need to have them "boiling" at this moment.
Then you start the heat, with an initial value of about 30%, and also start a timer.
You can use a smartphone app, like coffeeroastingtimer.github.io
After some... 30 seconds... you can start increase the heat about 10-15% per minute, in order to reach 75% at the moment when the beans turn from the "green" hue to a pale yellow hue, about minute 3-4.
If this point, called dry end is not reached in this time window, note this detail somewhere, in order to change the power approach next time, by increasing/decreasing the start value, and ramp to high power value.
Do not stop the roast if you are at first roast outside this guideline, the roast is not ruined !
From there let the roast progress with heat at 75% and just observe... if the beans dance become too violent lower the air in small steps, just to maintain a permanent bubbling, i.e vertical movement , from bottom to surface.
Somewhere in the 6-8 minutes ballpark you should see beans browning to a cinnamon hue, then even darker, and the cracks should start.
The beans agitation will become wild, they increased as volume, and massive chaff will be ejected outside.
Note this first crack moment, and wait for the cracks to finish, note that moment too... and from there you are faced with decisions...
If you finish that moment, by cutting the heater and let the air cool the beans, it is expected to have a medium roast. If you want a darker roast you should keep heater on and wait for the desired degree of roast, we are already in the subjective appreciation realm now... you will decide after some roasts what is your favorite degree of roast.
If the first cracks started before minute 6, then the heat was too high, and the 75% power level should be reduced for next roast.
If the first cracks started after minute 9, then the heat was too low, and the 75% power level should be increased for next roast.

For even more sophisticated profiling you need a thermometer.
 
renatoa
If you are ok losing the cooling feature, I can think to a minimalistic approach that I tried for other machine in the past, that is still very simple, but better than on-off.
The additional hardware needed for this approach is a switch and a high power diode.
Also, please note that for this approach you will need to stir in the beans with a wood stick or spoon... another drawback...
 
Ploni
Excellent! Thanks, ren.

That 7:32 AM post is priceless. Never found that information elsewhere.

Let's see how easily I can obtain those components. I agree with you that it's best to strive to do it right.
 
Ploni
For even more sophisticated profiling you need a thermometer.

Could we incorporate this in our build?

(I have it on hand already.)
Edited by Ploni on 10/19/2021 3:25 PM
 
renatoa
Sure, has no electrical connection with those listed so far.
 
renatoa
doesn't have a brand/model/name/code ?
 
Ploni
I see now that it's a Morris brand #57040.

https://www.morri...A0CA78B63E

The tip sensor of the thermometer wire is a small sphere like a drop of melted solder, not a long probe like a meat thermometer.
Ploni attached the following image:
image_morris57040.jpg

Edited by Ploni on 10/20/2021 9:18 AM
 
renatoa
Yep, that is the bare/naked junction, requires a sheath to be used for a specific purpose.
For coffee the simplest choice is a tube of brass/stainless, of 3-4 mm outer diameter.
 
Ploni
OK. Thanks . . . added to the list.

How long should it be?
Does the tip need to be closed (sealed) or can it be open?
Edited by Ploni on 10/24/2021 1:27 PM
 
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