Homeroasters - Home Roasting Coffee Community » THE ART OF ROASTING COFFEE » Roasting Coffee
Who is here? 1 guest(s)
Page 1 of 2: 12
 Print Thread
New to roasting. Could you help me with roasting advice?
Skyhawk4
Top  #1 Print Post
Posted on 01/03/2024 5:49 PM
Thank you in advance for helping me. I am using a Fresh Roast SR800 air roaster with the extension tube. I have a thermometer probe that sends bean temperatures to Artisan software so I can record roast data. I roast 225g batches at a time. My first batches were undrinkable and the beans looked under-roasted. I found out that the thermocouple was defective and replaced it, and now the beans are giving me "okay" coffee. Good but not great. I wondering if I am doing everything correctly though. So I thought I'd post here and see if anyone has suggestions for improving.

I roast 225g every time. I am roasting Sumatra Honey Process Kerinci Pendekar beans from Sweet Maria's. I attached a photo of the beans after the roast. And I have also attached a photo of the Artisan roast chart. The entire roast lasted 12:42 and the end bean temperature was 446 F. It took until 6:08 to finish the drying phase (at 300F) and First Crack was at 10:12 (at 410F).

My goal was to roast a Full City or even Full City+ batch. This was my 8th roast and each batch does produce better tasting coffee. I do a medium-fine grind for my AeroPress coffee maker. I have a hard time describing what the coffee tastes like, but I like a lot of body with that chocolate and caramel hint to it rather than the heavy fruit tones... LOL, if that makes any sense. Is there anything that looks like I'm off-track with this? What suggestions would you have for me to improve anything? Thanks... I'm totally clueless on this new roasting venture. I so appreciate ANY help you can give to me.
Skyhawk4 attached the following images:
8th_roast.png sumatra_bean_roast.jpg
 
Nomu-Bry
Top  #2 Print Post
Posted on 01/03/2024 6:42 PM
I love Kerinci beans! They have a lovely chocolate taste which suits me <3

For the roasting tip, I read in the roasting thread that Dry End should end between 3 1/2 to 5 min so maybe you should drop the dry end a little bit? Your maillard is okay, though for development time I might aim for 1 1/2 to 2 min max and see how it goes.

Usually 1C are 8-9 m. Maillard 5m max and dev time 3m max from what I know, or what I tried to put into my work.

The theories goes well for the 1st trial or until you get the "standard" taste and afterward you can tweak (longer acidity or more sweet or more body etc) according to you aim or your taste.

This is the theory for drum roasting though. I hope this can help you somehow. I didn't know much about air roaster yet so maybe there will be other to add to what I said Grin
 
Skyhawk4
Top  #3 Print Post
Posted on 01/03/2024 6:58 PM
Here is my handy-dandy little roasting plan I made up and followed (it is attached).
Skyhawk4 attached the following image:
temp_time_log_8th.jpg
Edited by Skyhawk4 on 01/03/2024 7:06 PM
 
renatoa
Top  #4 Print Post
Posted on 01/04/2024 3:16 AM
The simultaneous change at 5:30 was a bad idea, result being that drop of the profile.
Never change simultaneously both, change only one at a time, and let the change to show the effect. This means at least 15 seconds, but better 30.

Increase power to aim for shorter roast times, FB are high convection machines, likes under 8 minutes roasts.
My standard test profile for an unknown bean or FB machine is 3:20 dry, 6:40 FC, 8:00 drop.
More than 4 minutes for each phase is for machines with mechanical agitation. As posted above by @Nomu-Bry
 
allenb
Top  #5 Print Post
Posted on 01/04/2024 12:20 PM
Big welcome to HRO Skyhawk4!
Ditto on comments to go for faster profile with your machine being a fluidbed. Something I'll add is something that is not discussed much in roasting. Coffee likes to see real heat at the start of a roast and does not appreciate ET being gently raised. There's no need to preheat the machine unless it's very under powered. Find an ET that will kick start the roast and get the coffee to 250F in 2 minutes and dry (yellow) by 3 1/2 min as renatoa mentioned. Also, I'm in total agreement with 8 min end for most small fluidbeds.

As Nomu-Bry mentioned, after getting fairly good results, tweak this or that (one at a time) to look for improvements.

Now, there are some coffees, especially some Indonesians, that will hold on to too much earthy/woody funk with the typical short fluidbed profile. If the Kerinci is one of them, stretch drying and Maillard, a little at a time, stretching the 8 min roast until you find it suits you. I have some Colombian beans that do not like the shorter profile and I have to take them to no less than a 9-10 min fiinish.
1/2 lb and 1 lb drum, Siemens Sirocco fluidbed, presspot, chemex, cajun biggin brewer from the backwoods of Louisiana
 
Skyhawk4
Top  #6 Print Post
Posted on 01/04/2024 1:04 PM
Thank you for helping me with this. I was pretty lost and your input was very helpful. I took your advice and adjusted my roast plan accordingly. At least I tried. I'm so new to this that it seems like events happen pretty quick in that 8 minute period. I didn't make adjustments perfectly on time but I think I hit them pretty close. I will upload my adjusted plan (it was my 10th roast with this machine). And I'll load a photo of the beans from the roast.

EDIT: Looks like I need to get more heat early for drying to end earlier. I'll keep trying :-)
Skyhawk4 attached the following images:
10th_roastv4.jpg 10throastplan.jpg
Edited by Skyhawk4 on 01/04/2024 1:22 PM
 
renatoa
Top  #7 Print Post
Posted on 01/04/2024 1:22 PM
Pretty light... almost "rare". as in beef steak Grin
Weighing the outcome, and computing the weight loss as a percent could be very useful.
Like in 200 in 172 out = 28g loss = 14%, this being typical for medium roast range.
 
Skyhawk4
Top  #8 Print Post
Posted on 01/04/2024 1:28 PM

Quote

renatoa wrote:

Pretty light... almost "rare". as in beef steak Grin
Weighing the outcome, and computing the weight loss as a percent could be very useful.
Like in 200 in 172 out = 28g loss = 14%, this being typical for medium roast range.


Okay, I just weighed them. They went in at 225g and came out at 199g. So they lost 26g. So 11.5% weight loss. So going by the Sweet Maria's roasting chart that roast is City- and 418 degrees. Wow.
Edited by Skyhawk4 on 01/04/2024 2:12 PM
 
Skyhawk4
Top  #9 Print Post
Posted on 01/04/2024 4:12 PM
So my thermometer readings must be ~38 degrees low. I will adjust my target temps by that amount and run another batch through tonight.
 
Skyhawk4
Top  #10 Print Post
Posted on 01/04/2024 5:34 PM
Okay, I ran the exact same roasting plan but added 38-degrees to each temperature target.
Beans in = 225g
Beans out = 196
Weight loss = 29g = 12.9%

Better but not there yet.
Skyhawk4 attached the following image:
comparison_roasts.jpg
Edited by Skyhawk4 on 01/05/2024 3:59 PM
 
HarryDog
Top  #11 Print Post
Posted on 01/04/2024 7:50 PM
Those still look light if shooting for Full City or even Full City+.
Need to correct my comment now, I like the looks of that second picture, much better!

I enjoy lots of different coffee's in the City+ to Full City range on the sweet Maria's chart.
so 13.3% - 14.5% range. Espresso occasionally at 15%.

Keep tasting as you go to find where you like your roasts.
Edited by HarryDog on 01/05/2024 6:18 PM
 
Skyhawk4
Top  #12 Print Post
Posted on 01/04/2024 9:39 PM

Quote

HarryDog wrote:

Those still look light if shooting for Full City or even Full City+.

I enjoy lots of different coffee's in the City+ to Full City range on the sweet Maria's chart.
so 13.3% - 14.5% range. Espresso occasionally at 15%.

Keep tasting as you go to find where you like your roasts.


I'm having a lot of fun so far, even though I have a lot to learn. I try to keep good notes as I go through the learning curve with this roaster. One thing about the lighter roasts I have noticed is that it seems like the flavors now are really interesting. LOL, my first roasts were un-drinkable... nasty stuff for sure. But the last couple of roasts were actually not bad even though I do want a better roast closer to Full City. I am so looking forward to trying more and more different beans once I get better with this roaster.
 
renatoa
Top  #13 Print Post
Posted on 01/05/2024 2:30 AM
It seems you discovered the Holy Grail of flavors... it is there, under medium roast.
After full city, charcoal "flavor" begins muting the flavors that identify the beans origin.
 
allenb
Top  #14 Print Post
Posted on 01/05/2024 5:16 AM

Quote

Skyhawk4 wrote:

Okay, I ran the exact same roasting plan but added 38-degrees to each temperature target.
Beans in = 225g
Beans out = 196
Weight loss = 29g = 12.9%

Better but not there yet.


No wonder this still looks light, you posted the same photo from post 6 but with slightly different cropping.limb
1/2 lb and 1 lb drum, Siemens Sirocco fluidbed, presspot, chemex, cajun biggin brewer from the backwoods of Louisiana
 
Piotrkurak
Top  #15 Print Post
Posted on 01/05/2024 9:22 AM
Allenb has a cheap columbian bean that experiments really well for new roaster trials.

Cheap enough that you can trashcan a bad batch, and it responds to changed nuances in the roast with different BUT still tasty results even over a couple of buys spaced across different harvests.

Doesn't do starbuck level roasts well, however, butbthat might be just me.
 
Skyhawk4
Top  #16 Print Post
Posted on 01/05/2024 9:41 AM

Quote

renatoa wrote:

It seems you discovered the Holy Grail of flavors... it is there, under medium roast.
After full city, charcoal "flavor" begins muting the flavors that identify the beans origin.


This morning I brewed up a cup from that City+ batch expecting to be disappointed because I was shooting for Full City+ in that roast. But I was truly stunned. That flavor was incredible! I totally was not expecting that... the flavor was so smooth and balanced. And I could truly taste the nuances of the coffee. Funny how things sometimes surprise you. Well, the good news is that I meticulously recorded exactly how I did that roast. So I should (hopefully) be able to use that as my foundation (my base) for exploring the bean roasting world from here.

Words truly cannot express my gratitude for your help (and everyone's help) because I was floundering and lost - and kind of despairing that I couldn't figure out how to get my roaster to roast beans well. But your help got me to where I needed to go... LOL, it wasn't where I expected to go (the City+ thing) but it was ultimately where I needed to go with this roaster. I will have fun experimenting from here. I'll tinker and have fun with some darker roasts too... but yes, this does seem like the holy grail roast for my personal taste preference. Thanks, everyone. This forum is the bees knees :-)
 
Skyhawk4
Top  #17 Print Post
Posted on 01/05/2024 9:49 AM

Quote



No wonder this still looks light, you posted the same photo from post 6 but with slightly different cropping.limb


LOL, you're right! I did not notice that until you posted this. I'll try to go back and post the correct photo. The beans are slightly darker in that batch but not a lot darker. I ground a bit of the beans and compared it to that chart from Sweet Maria's and it clearly is a City+ roast. And when I brewed a cup up this morning I was very surprised that I found that I really like the roast level flavor I got. In fact I was shocked by how much I liked it. I wasn't expecting that at all.
 
Skyhawk4
Top  #18 Print Post
Posted on 01/05/2024 4:03 PM

Quote

allenb wrote:

Quote

Skyhawk4 wrote:

Okay, I ran the exact same roasting plan but added 38-degrees to each temperature target.
Beans in = 225g
Beans out = 196
Weight loss = 29g = 12.9%

Better but not there yet.


No wonder this still looks light, you posted the same photo from post 6 but with slightly different cropping.limb


I just corrected the post with the correct photo. Thanks, that was a good catch. I also posted the new image along side the original roast for comparison. I do believe it is now a City+ roast when I weighed the before/after roasted beans and also ground up some of the beans and compared that with the Sweet Maria's roasting chart. It looked exactly like that City+ image on their chart, color-wise.
Skyhawk4 attached the following image:
comparison_roasts_1.jpg
 
allenb
Top  #19 Print Post
Posted on 01/06/2024 12:46 PM

Quote

Piotrkurak wrote:

Allenb has a cheap columbian bean that experiments really well for new roaster trials.

Cheap enough that you can trashcan a bad batch, and it responds to changed nuances in the roast with different BUT still tasty results even over a couple of buys spaced across different harvests.

Doesn't do starbuck level roasts well, however, butbthat might be just me.


I think you're referring to the happymug Santa Barbara Colombian. Unfortunately, this one isn't available right now but next crop would definitely be worth trying some to see if it will be equal in quality to the previous crop.
1/2 lb and 1 lb drum, Siemens Sirocco fluidbed, presspot, chemex, cajun biggin brewer from the backwoods of Louisiana
 
Skyhawk4
Top  #20 Print Post
Posted on 02/16/2024 5:19 PM
I am now satisfied with my medium-roast recipe that I use for my Fresh Roast SR800. But I had one more question. I have kept my bean weights to 225 grams for every roast in order to not have a changing roast variable as I was learning how to use my roaster. But I really only need 100 gram batches at a time. If I reduce my bean mass from 225g to 100g will that make a significant change to my roasts? I know... I should just try a batch and see what happens. But thought I'd ask here first to just get a ball park on what to expect. My gut feeling is that I will need to reduce air flow for a smaller bean mass. But that will increase heat - I have noticed that reducing the air by one level has more impact on the heat to the beans than the heat-power setting.

Anyway, I was just curious and thought I'd ask here first. Here is my current Artisan reading for my 225g medium roast. The dark line is the bean temp curve and the red line is the exhaust temp. The lighter blue line is the bean temp change delta. The resulting roast consistently comes out between City+ and Full City (right there between those two levels).
Skyhawk4 attached the following image:
mediumroast.png
 
renatoa
Top  #21 Print Post
Posted on 02/17/2024 4:02 AM
What about BT probe with 100 grams ? Does it measure close enough ?
 
Mike_Mathis
Top  #22 Print Post
Posted on 02/17/2024 7:37 AM
My suggestion is to take the extension tube out of play. You should have no issue with bean movement with the stock chamber and only 100g.
*Kaffelogic Nano 7
*Skywalker V1
*2023 BC-2
 
Skyhawk4
Top  #23 Print Post
Posted on 02/17/2024 10:26 AM

Quote

renatoa wrote:

What about BT probe with 100 grams ? Does it measure close enough ?


Good question. I would need to adjust it down a bit to be in the lower-level due to the lower bean amount.
 
Skyhawk4
Top  #24 Print Post
Posted on 02/18/2024 10:45 PM

Quote

Mike_Mathis wrote:

My suggestion is to take the extension tube out of play. You should have no issue with bean movement with the stock chamber and only 100g.


That's a good suggestion but I didn't want the hassle of changing back-and-forth with the extension tube. When I do a roast I sometimes have limited time. So I kept the extension tube but I did lower the temperature probe for the lessor bean amounts.

For anyone interested in doing 100g roasts in the SR800 w/extension tube installed, my experience was that I did have to lower the air settings which brought up the heat temperatures... so I also had to adjust my heat-power settings lower. What I found confusing at first, was that by lowering my temperature probe to accommodate the smaller bean mass, my temp readings were different. Maybe it was simply due to the probe being closer to the heating element? Whatever the cause, it meant that I had to do a few roasts to understand what the new readings meant as far as my roast recipes. Not a big deal but thought I'd toss this out there in case anyone else tries this. LOL, it DID throw me a bit at first, confusing me.

The good news is that after a few practice roasts I'm dialed in for 100g roasts. I can still do the big roasts when I want to. But it is nice to be able to accurately repeat 100g roasts now as needed. I've tried the 3 main types of coffee beans that I like (a Yemen, an Ethiopian and a Sumatra) and all three are producing coffee flavors that I like.
 
Skyhawk4
Top  #25 Print Post
Posted on 05/14/2024 12:46 PM
I thought I'd post an update on my roasting journey so far. I have to admit it has been a humbling experience. It just took me a lot longer than I thought to get to the point I feel I know my roaster well. Don't laugh (okay do laugh), it took me about 70 roasts before I felt I was really competent with my setup. Some lessons learned:

Ambient temperatures had a huge impact on my roasts, and I didn't realize this at first. I roast in my garage where it's as cold as 45 degrees in winter. And it gets pretty hot there on hot days... I now have roasting plans for various temperature tiers now. But it totally threw me at first.

Instead of watching BT to guide my roast, I find it better for me if I start my roast with initial settings that fit the ambient temps and then watch ROR after the 3 minute mark. I'm at around 300 degrees F at that point. It varies with different beans, but I'm usually in that ballpark. I do have different roast profiles for the bean types I roast (and ambient temps).

I found it better for me when I roast the exact same bean weight every roast. And I aim for City+ with the roasts ending in the City to Full City range. LOL, I'm a happy camper if I can just hit that range. I can't get it any more precise than that. And I like my coffee anywhere in that range (usually it's City+ though). I use moisture loss % to judge where my roasts are, using the Sweet Maria's roast level card. I also grind the beans and match the color on the flip side of that SM's card too. But the moisture loss seems to be most accurate for my purposes.

I find the coffee flavors I like best usually come from roasts that end around 8.5 minutes. But they vary from 8 to 9 minutes now. I drop and cool my roasts going by sight and not by the Artisan temps. This seems to work best for me.

Finally, I had no clue as to how long the learning curve would be, as far as the entire coffee process from understanding what green coffee beans make the coffee I like best, the roasting component, proper storage of the beans (resting time too), and all of the component associated with coffee brewing (that was a rabbit hole for me... figuring out brewing method and options with it). I'm finally at a point where I can relax and enjoy this coffee thing now. Gotta admit I was stressing while on the learning journey to this point. Oh, and one final thing. Now that I feel very comfortable with the Fresh Roast SR800, I have zero desire to every change roasters... not because this roaster is so good, but rather I don't want to have to learn another one. I'm sure I am a slow learner on this. It was humbling. But the coffee is really worth it now. I had no idea how good coffee could taste until now.
Edited by Skyhawk4 on 05/14/2024 1:36 PM
 
Page 1 of 2: 12
Jump to Forum: